Comments on: Augustine’s Letter of Semi-Predestinationism http://www.hundiejo.com/augustine%e2%80%99s-letter-of-semi-predestinationism Just another WordPress weblog Fri, 05 Dec 2008 11:28:29 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.5 By: Henry Imler http://www.hundiejo.com/augustine%e2%80%99s-letter-of-semi-predestinationism#comment-1237 Henry Imler Fri, 19 Jan 2007 16:37:15 +0000 http://unsoundargument.com/blog/?p=131#comment-1237 Mike W, I think that Augustine comes to a contradiction himself and then tries to find a way to make everything work. Augustine came to the conclusion that God is absolutely sovereign in the election of the believers and yet there were some that were called that did not believe. He solved this problem by suggesting that God worded the calling in such a way that only those he selected would end up responding to it. He only called, say 100 people. He elected, say 50 of those people. So first he freed the will of the called, so that they now had the freedom of the will to choose or reject God. God then tailored the call to achieve his desired results, since He foreknew how each of the 100 would respond to a call. This is just an exegetical post, not my personal beliefs on the issue at hand. Where have I deviated from the true reading of the letter? I was restricting my view of Augustine to merely the letter at hand. Elsewhere on this site, I tried to examine <a href="http://unsoundargument.com/the-ethics-of-god/the-quick-change-artist" rel="nofollow">his thoughts on this matter as a whole</a>.<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('1237','Henry Imler'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('1237','Henry Imler','Mike W,\n\nI think that Augustine comes to a contradiction himself and then tries to find a way to make everything work.\n\nAugustine came to the conclusion that God is absolutely sovereign in the election of the believers and yet there were some that were called that did not believe.\n\nHe solved this problem by suggesting that God worded the calling in such a way that only those he selected would end up responding to it. He only called, say 100 people. He elected, say 50 of those people. So first he freed the will of the called, so that they now had the freedom of the will to choose or reject God. God then tailored the call to achieve his desired results, since He foreknew how each of the 100 would respond to a call.\n\n\nThis is just an exegetical post, not my personal beliefs on the issue at hand. Where have I deviated from the true reading of the letter? I was restricting my view of Augustine to merely the letter at hand. Elsewhere on this site, I tried to examine <a href=\"http:\/\/unsoundargument.com\/the-ethics-of-god\/the-quick-change-artist\" rel=\"nofollow\">his thoughts on this matter as a whole<\/a>.'); return false;">Quote</a></div> Mike W,

I think that Augustine comes to a contradiction himself and then tries to find a way to make everything work.

Augustine came to the conclusion that God is absolutely sovereign in the election of the believers and yet there were some that were called that did not believe.

He solved this problem by suggesting that God worded the calling in such a way that only those he selected would end up responding to it. He only called, say 100 people. He elected, say 50 of those people. So first he freed the will of the called, so that they now had the freedom of the will to choose or reject God. God then tailored the call to achieve his desired results, since He foreknew how each of the 100 would respond to a call.

This is just an exegetical post, not my personal beliefs on the issue at hand. Where have I deviated from the true reading of the letter? I was restricting my view of Augustine to merely the letter at hand. Elsewhere on this site, I tried to examine his thoughts on this matter as a whole.

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]]> By: Mike W http://www.hundiejo.com/augustine%e2%80%99s-letter-of-semi-predestinationism#comment-1236 Mike W Tue, 09 Jan 2007 14:10:25 +0000 http://unsoundargument.com/blog/?p=131#comment-1236 The statements you quote by Augustine necessarily contradict your conclusion. If God gives us "the power to will and the thing we actually will", how then am I only enabled to choose God at his temporal calling and still free to choose rebellion instead of God? Augustine is historically regarded as a believer in the full predestination of God. I believe you have read into him the typical devise of human reason in attempting to mesh causality with sovereignty. Most people who believe in predestination do not claim to admit full understanding as to how the two mesh together, but simply assert that is what Scripture teaches us and the apparent laws of causality restrict our understanding of a God who operates without the boundaries of time and space.<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('1236','Mike W'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('1236','Mike W','The statements you quote by Augustine necessarily contradict your conclusion. If God gives us \"the power to will and the thing we actually will\", how then am I only enabled to choose God at his temporal calling and still free to choose rebellion instead of God? Augustine is historically regarded as a believer in the full predestination of God. I believe you have read into him the typical devise of human reason in attempting to mesh causality with sovereignty. Most people who believe in predestination do not claim to admit full understanding as to how the two mesh together, but simply assert that is what Scripture teaches us and the apparent laws of causality restrict our understanding of a God who operates without the boundaries of time and space.'); return false;">Quote</a></div> The statements you quote by Augustine necessarily contradict your conclusion. If God gives us “the power to will and the thing we actually will”, how then am I only enabled to choose God at his temporal calling and still free to choose rebellion instead of God? Augustine is historically regarded as a believer in the full predestination of God. I believe you have read into him the typical devise of human reason in attempting to mesh causality with sovereignty. Most people who believe in predestination do not claim to admit full understanding as to how the two mesh together, but simply assert that is what Scripture teaches us and the apparent laws of causality restrict our understanding of a God who operates without the boundaries of time and space.
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